Which takes precedence? Unfortunately, the highest CR beast is currently the Tyrannosaurus Rex at CR 8. How do I stop the Flickering on Mode 13h? Speaking of seeing the thing you intend to turn into, from the same Dragon Talk mentioned above, theres some vagueness about what seeing one actually means. The other big difference is that polymorph is one and done while shapechange allows you to continuously change what you've shapechanged into. If it is misused, it should be addressed. by Tarven Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:00 am, Post Like a summon. 3:10 PM - 17 Sep 2015, Joshua Maxman You're a level 17+ Wizard and you cast True Polymorph on yourself to turn yourself into a CR 17 Adult Gold Dragon. the druids normal form is reduced to 0 hit points. As soon as you begin casting the second spell, the first breaks and its effects, including your new form, end. I have the idea that the "or dies" was for all other cases than PC, and the 0 HP was 'for all cases PC and those rare special NPC's that get to use the 0 HP rule." Which means that the PC is now double Polymorphed, but since True Sight says . Sorry, read the power wrong. During this spells duration, you can use your action to assume a different form following the same restrictions and rules for the original form, with one exception: if your new form has more hit points than your current one, your hit points remain at their current value. Spellcasting is a class feature, and the rule on components (PH, 203) says what is physically required to cast spells. Does the druid simply leave beast form? This passage at the very end of it's description is what sets it apart. Your game statistics are replaced by the statistics of the chosen creature, though you retain your alignment and Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores. What happens when a Polymorphed creature is reduced to 0 HP by Disintegrate? Shapechange targets self, where true polymorph can target others. You could TP into her to get another 9th level slot theoretically, but you'd be limited to casting what she can so you can't cheese another slot to also cast Wish. The description of the polymorph spell states that "A shapechanger automatically succeeds on this saving throw". For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Why don't we use the 7805 for car phone chargers? It reverts to its true form if it dies. The creature cant be a construct or an undead, and you must have seen the sort of creature at least once. As long as the excess damage doesn't reduce your normal form to 0 hit points, you aren't knocked unconscious. If you concentrate on this spell for the full duration, the spell lasts until it is dispelled. I seem to recall that matters. Most GMs have a monster die the instant it drops to 0 hit points, rather than having it fall unconscious and make death saving throws. If I turn you into a gold statue of yourself and then use Fabricate to explode you into a literal pile of money (remember Fabricate starts you convert raw materials into products of the same material), then give each of these cursed gold pieces to a different member of my pirate crew that I scatter throughout the world, what happens if one gold piece gets dispelled? Deciding what actions the new creature takes and how it moves isnt called out as requiring any kind of action on your part, or even interaction with the creature. Why the obscure but specific description of Jane Doe II in the original complaint for Westenbroek v. Kappa Kappa Gamma Fraternity? Worn equipment functions as normal. The target assumes the hit points of its new form, and when it reverts to its normal form, the creature returns to the number of hit points it had before it transformed. When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit points you had before you transformed. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. If we are going to follow SRD for almost everything as a standard, then we should adapt it for shape change. RPGBOT uses the color coding scheme which has become common among Pathfinder build handbooks, which is simple to understand and easy to read at a glance. as the excess damage doesnt reduce your normal form to 0 hit points, This allows you to do some interesting cheese where you cast a Contingency Dispel Magic and say When I think unmorph me of my own free will, cast Dispel Magic to target the True Polymorph running on me, then live for up to just shy of 10 days as an Ancient Brass Dragon, flip to human for a moment, and go back to being a dragon. Keep in mind that nothing prevents the wizard from making his clone in case he dies while in his TP form. RPGBOT uses the color coding scheme which has become common among Pathfinder build handbooks, which is simple to understand and easy to read at a glance. Obviously if you aren't concentrating you don't have to worry about breaking concentration. Wizards of the Coast LLC. The hour a level being suggested here seems extreme to me, for the FK environment. @Sawyer that's a good question, and also opens up my answer to the following criticism: in the case of True Polymorph and Shapechange, they are ninth level spells and as such would take precedence over a sixth level spell unless it was cast an 9th level to do more damage. This means that you would not gain the Spellcasting trait since the "Introduction" to the Monster Manual clarifies (emphasis mine): A monster with the Spellcasting class feature has a spellcaster level and spell slots, which it uses to cast its spells of 1st level and higher (as explained in the Players Handbook). The change shape feature of the Brass dragon says (emphasis mine): The dragon magically polymorphs into a humanoid or beast that has a challenge rating no higher than its own. Yeahhh.. What are you talking about? by Gwain Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:22 pm, Post by Nylo Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:47 pm, Post If one rules that way, True Polymorph, Polymorph, Wildshape, and Shapechange become special defenses against the Disintegrate spell, even though these spells already provide the added benefit of an extra HP pool for the creature in that shape. The "or dies" can be applied to all creatures that are not a PC; those creatures usually die when dropped to 0 HP. I am making the case for Disintegrate, as a 6th level spell and it's stated effect of also destroying all of the equipment that isn't magical, being given precedence. It may not display this or other websites correctly. And comparing to Polymorph. Creature into Creature. True Polymorph and Polymorph both say target assumes the hit points of its new form, and when it reverts to its normal form, the creature returns to the number of hit points it had before it transformed. Now use the ghost to magically age the shadow dragon into an ancient gold shadow dragon. You get the same benefits of Polymorph but there are a few key additions: 1) You can cast spells and still use your race and class features if your new form lets you. That's my take on it, though I will point out that Jeremy Crawford is a D&D dev. The only catch is that you can't regain HP this way - if you shapechange into a new form (not the initial casting) that has higher HP than what you're currently changed as, you keep the same HP. Is the caster concentration for an hour to make the TP permanent? Which are the best True Polymorph forms to cheese this spell? I suggest picking a form for disabling enemies by turning enemies into it, a form for scouting, and a general combat form. Essentially, a druid like this would be able to stay shapechanged -indefinitely-. True Polymorph only lets you use the abilities of the thing you change into and you lose your race and class features while transformed. Shapechange gives more cheesy options, like a Pit Fiend bladesinging, with shield spell mastery. You assume the form of a different creature for the duration. But what about their personality? The creature can be restored to life only by means of a true resurrection or a wish spell. You cannot use lair or legendary "actions", but it says nothing about legendary "saves" and most of the upper tier dragons have 3 of those. Does the Way of the Long Death monk's Mastery of Death feature protect against the Disintegrate spell? "Signpost" puzzle from Tatham's collection, Generating points along line with specifying the origin of point generation in QGIS. I'll go ahead and throw my support behind this idea. Its certainly simpler. You also retain all of your skill and saving throw proficiencies, in addition to gaining those of the creature. Maybe I can get the dev to reply to that, or not. At least of the Chromatic and Metallic standards. Some will argue that this would move the "balance" in the direction of "unbalanced" or "too powerful." A difficult CR. Nothing will happen on this front until the basic polymorph code is fixed to address some of the mechanisms by which it is unbalancing and/or subject to abuse. If the Power Word Kill spell is cast on a Polymorphed creature, what happens? You could also True Polymorph someone else, and they would be free to polymorph into something else. This links in to the "what happens when you are reduced to 0 HP" rule. Does a Clone spell work on a (True) Polymorphed creature? Apparently, RAI is in opposition to my other answer. The lowest CR that you should realistically consider combat forms. The entire basis of the Disintegrate spell is to turn something to ash, and there doesn't seem to be anything in the polymorph spell that would counter that or stop the disintegration. This gets weird when we have multiple stat blocks, a la dragons. You can get a simulacrum to do the same, it's better to murder stuff with company after all. It seems to me that the concentration requirement would make it almost useless. True polymorph and the dragon Change Shape feature. I brought up a problematic point a moment ago with golems when dealing with created/animated creatures. True polymorph changes you once and that's it. rev2023.5.1.43405. By what metric are we going to judge that? Shapechange only turns you into another creature. Speaking of gold, this is an even better way of breaking economies than Wish, which is impressive. Outside of combat, the target is likely friendly to their allies, but is likely driven by basic animal stuff. If you want to support your answer as written, suggest you refer to the sage advice compendium, page 14, since JCrawford covered both cases in that SA final draft. The spell lasts for the duration, or until the target drops to 0 hit points or dies. 3) You can use an action to change forms during your Shapechange. You cant use any special senses you have (for example, darkvision) unless your new form also has that sense. You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them, provided that your new form is physically capable of doing so. This spell seems to me to be a worse true polymorph. "Note that the verbiage of the phrasing means you can attempt your Con save and IF you fail it, just use one of the Legendary Resistances. That target almost certainly cant speak or understand speech unless its also under some other effect like Comprehend Languages. This spell gives the willing creature you touch the ability to see things as they actually are. Next paragraph: The creature is limited in the actions it can perform by the nature of its new form, and it cant speak, cast spells, or take any other action that requires hands or speech, unless its new form is capable of such actions.. When the spell states that you take the form of "any creature with a challenge rating equal to your level or lower", does this mean the players class level, spell-caster level, or total level from all classes. The 4th level spell, Polymorph, explicitly only allows turning into beasts. Polymorph (both regular and true), Shapechange, and Wildshape all have a consistent rule of reverting to original form when 0 HP are reached, and can be summarized as follows: If you revert as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to your normal form. When true polymorphed creature dies, does it revert to its original form? For the duration, the creature has truesight, notices secret doors hidden by magic, and can see into the Ethereal Plane, all out to a range of 120 feet. The druid turns to dust, since the spell disintegrates you the instant you drop to 0 hit points. Next paragraph: The targets gear melds into the new form. Just because a form you take is capable of casting spells does not mean you can inherently cast any spells that arent part of that stat block. Role-playing Games Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for gamemasters and players of tabletop, paper-and-pencil role-playing games. I recently discovered that many people share my profound enthusiasm for turning things into other things which, combined with fantasizing about high level spells as one often does, led me to make a guide where I discussed some of the fantastic utility available using True Polymorph and Shapechange. "Legendary Resistance (3/Day). We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. Dont consider combat forms from CR 0; there are better options available the moment you get Polymorph. Shapechange IMO is more useful in a combat scenario. Allies may need to use Animal Handling to direct the target (they are a best now, after all). I think it goes off of the players total level, so in your example, they would be able to become a CR 20. depends on the DM's decision of whether they would be considered a construct or something more unique I suppose. added, Joshua Maxman @Orethalion A pile of dust is not a creature. True Polymorph didn't exist before 5th edition and is an odd combination of Polymorph Any Object and Shapechange that has the notable distinction of being permanent if you can concentrate on it for the full hour. You're also more than welcome to link to my handbook if you want extra information available in the shapechange spell description in yours. Can I use an 11 watt LED bulb in a lamp rated for 8.6 watts maximum? You decide what action it takes and how it moves. #DnD So I could choose brass dragon, but then what age category am I? For example, if you transformed into a Drow Matron Mother, you would not gain access to her ability to cast spells or her spell list - you'd still have your own spells and spell slots, however. Of course, many groups will simply allow whoever got turned into a T-Rex to do as they please. Portions of the materials used are property of Wizards of the Coast. Not approved/endorsed by Wizards. Im going to list a few great options for Undead and Constructs here since I cover everything else down in the Shapechange section. The GM has the creatures statistics and resolves all of its actions and movement. the druid, not the beast form, drops to 0 hp. Once you understand how the spell works the most important decision you make is what form to select. normal form. Right now I believe it is correct to say they are identical save with respect to what races are allowed as targets. Autumn is a second spring where every leaf has its turn to be a flower. Maxman How does polymorph work? Otherwise, the target likely attacks the nearest enemy in combat. Shapechange only turns you into another creature. All of this detail diving violates KISS principle, which is why I tried to focus on the "spell effect" and its unusual " and your equipment too" detail as significant. The targets game statistics, including mental ability scores, are replaced by the statistics of the new form. by Tarven Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:13 pm, Post (RAW). Ok, a few things here. If it reverts as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to its normal form. Equipment that merges has no effect in that state. you arent knocked unconscious. Does Disintegrate reduce the a Polymorphed target to dust first or does the creature revert to its regular form first? Dan Dillon (@Dan_Dillon_1) April 18, 2016. Or at least thats what youd think, if you hadnt read this Sage Advice. Is there a generic term for these trajectories? But then they will encounter the same problem if they try to do it a second time. Any equipment it is wearing or carrying isn't transformed. Are animated things like Golems and Strangling Rugs creatures since they have stat blocks and therefore fair game, or are they magic items and therefore verboten? True Polymorph is best used on your allies and minions as they'll make better use of turning into a beholder or better use of becoming a pit fiend than you will. You can turn an object into any kind of creature, as long as the creatures size is no larger than the objects size and the creatures challenge rating is 9 or lower. The new form can be of any creature with a challenge rating equal to your level or lower. A few last thoughts. Wizard. Never noticed that, always looked at the spell and not the trait. There are several things that posters in this thread don't seem to realize about True Polymorph: that would likely become a DM discretion thing. The other answers seem to assume that as a rule and are forgetting that death in animal form is stated to also revert you, not just dropping to 0 HP. Can True Polymorph create creatures with the Spellcasting feature? Use In-Game Forum commands to activate your forum account, It is currently Mon May 01, 2023 11:12 pm, We can put them in a helpfile and also keep them available on the, Time for the ability/skill should be increased. 1.0, How to break the game with Animal Messenger (starting at level 3), AMFES: Summer 2, Now with Digital Tokens Included, 2020 Holiday Ornament and Black Friday Sale, If this is your first visit, be sure to If you turn a creature into an object, it transforms along with whatever it is wearing and carrying into that form, as long as the objects size is no larger than the creatures size. Boy. Fully open to DM interpretation and therefore argument. @BlueMoon93 Thanks, not sure if I can revive it; this is a good example of why it is important to avoid a link without a summary/sample of what's there. If you turn a creature into an object, it transforms along with whatever it is wearing and carrying into that form, as long as the objects size is no larger than the creatures size. When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit Why refined oil is cheaper than cold press oil? As long as the excess damage doesnt reduce your normal form to 0 hit points, you arent knocked unconscious. I assume that means that allies are still allies, and enemies are still enemies. The consent submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website.